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From a great (but long) piece by Michael Pettis exhaustively discussing the economics behind transit fares and placing the question in the context of the Chinese development model:
For those who don’t know Beijing well, when I first moved here in 2002 the city was poorly served by its subway system. This huge and sprawling city only had two lines, one running along Chang’an jie, often called the “Champs-Elysées” of Beijing, which runs east-west through Tiananmen Square, and the other circling around the inner city where the old city walls used to be before they were knocked down – in the 1960s I think – below what is now the Second Ring Road.

Since then, and especially during the build-up to the Olympics in 2008, the city has exploded with subway lines so that Beijing has become, in my opinion, one of the best served cities in the world for its subway system. The outer districts of the city are not well-served by subway (although there are plenty of buses) but, within the city proper, getting around by subway is very easy and fairly quick, including all the way out to the Wudaokou District, where China’s two most famous universities, Peking University and Tsinghua University, as well as many famous and less famous schools, are located. I do most of my travel within the city by bicycle or taxi, but for longer trips I usually take the subway, from my home or office to the university, for example, because traffic in Beijing can be terrible and almost always takes a lot longer than the subway.

The real problem with driving I Beijing, by the way, is not just the traffic jams, but mainly the uncertainty about how long it can take to get anywhere. In Mexico, it seems to me, the traffic is horrible but predictable, so that you are pretty sure that you will be 45 minutes late for every meeting. In fact during my days as a Wall Street debt trader whenever I was in Mexico and arrived at a senior government official’s office fifteen minutes late, instead of apologizing profusely for being late I felt I had to apologize profusely for coming early. The secretary inevitably looked shocked and no one was prepared to meet me.

In Beijing, on the other hand, I have arrived at meetings anywhere from 20 minutes early to one hour late. It is really hard to predict how long a car trip might take. This makes the subway hugely valuable because you can usually time your trip to within 5-10 minutes.

As an aside, in Beijing someone as “important” as a PKU professor like me shouldn’t take the subway. It is low status. If you see a middle-aged well-dressed person on the subway (not that I am ever well-dressed) he is almost certain to be foreign. Two weeks ago for example I had been asked to join two very wealthy Chinese – one a billionaire, I think – for coffee. When I got up to leave to get to my class, one of them very kindly said he would have his chauffer pick me up immediately and take me to Peking University. When I thanked him and told him I didn’t really have time to take a car and would have to take the subway, both of them shot me shocked glances, and one of them even commented on my dedication.
This whole idea of transit being only for people who can't afford a car isn't just an American thing. It annoys me no end personally, but I get that this really is a popular sentiment in many parts of the world.

(earthling177, I thought of you when I read his article. Prof. Pettis goes into detail about many points we've talked about: who wins and who loses from a flat fare vs. fares by distance, what considerations go into a minimum fare, and so forth.)

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:24 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] quietann.livejournal.com
It irks me, too. I take the commuter rail and subway, and have coworkers who find this horrifying. After the 27-miles-in-2+-hours drive from home to (roughly) where I work on Thursday, I don't understand why people drive!

It may be similar to the "bottle feeding is better" sentiment in some developing countries, where using formula shows you have more status/money/a more modern outlook -- even if your water supply is literally full of crap and using it to mix formula makes your baby sick.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 10:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
It may be similar to the "bottle feeding is better" sentiment in some developing countries, where using formula shows you have more status/money/a more modern outlook

That's pretty clearly what it is. Status over practicality is fairly common, after all.

(I really like the analogy!)

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 11:56 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cityratbuddy.livejournal.com
Bangkok transit is incredibly classist. There aren't many sidewalks because they're viewed as only for the scum of the earth. Anyone well off has a motorbike or a car. I walk and take the bus, so I guess I'm scum.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 02:49 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] achinhibitor.livejournal.com
Advertising your class is important, because people will treat you differently based on it. Even Pettis is quite conversant with class-signs, he refers to "a middle-aged well-dressed person". But his role in China is sufficiently outre that taking the subway won't hurt his career.

Status over practicality is fairly common, after all.

If it was more practical, doing it wouldn't show (1) you have the resources to do it, and (2) you know that it is important to do it.
Edited Date: 2014-11-25 02:51 pm (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
I note that he does say "(not that I am ever well-dressed)".

But I'm also well aware of the point and uses of class maintenance and signaling. I like observing the absurdity of it from any non-status standpoint.

I'm also pleased my role in China (and in most places) is "sufficiently outre" as you put it, that I don't have to worry about that.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
Right with you there! I take the big non-air conditioned red government buses and miss the furiously driven green private ones! But hey, neither of us has to worry about our class status.

Also, I'm a transit geek, so I occasionally end up taking the Skytrain or subway even when it's more expensive and out of my way. I've even taken the train to Don Muang! (Not really worth doing, truthfully.)

One thing I will say is that getting into the subway is a great way to cool off! Bangkok needs more underground malls connected to the subway that let you hide from the heat.

But yeah, Bangkok and Thailand is really classist in many ways apart from transit as well.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:44 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
(I even stopped myself before I said anything more that might be prohibited by the regime! :) )

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cityratbuddy.livejournal.com
I tried to plus one or like this comment before I realized we are on LJ. Hee hee hee! I'm so old!

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 03:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cityratbuddy.livejournal.com
The most frequent buses are non-AC, but I take buses many times a week that are nice and chilly, just like the BKK subway/skytrain.

I appreciate what you're saying about us not worrying about our class status, but I am worried about my safety. That's one issue that's motivated me to leave BKK. The road where I live has some 90 degree turns and some drivers are not careful about turning into the sidewalk. I've come face to face with motorbikes too many times. I'm uninjured so far, knock on wood.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 05:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
Yeah, I prefer the non-AC buses because a) the breeze from the windows is often enough to keep me cool and b) they are flat-fare, which means I don't have to think about explaining my destination, understanding how much to pay, etc. Also I get to see out the windows! Many of those AC buses have rather dark curtains.

That said, AC is definitely nice.

As far as safety goes, I hear you. Oh boy, do I hear you.

People who don't visit places like Bangkok have no idea. They have all kinds of silly concerns about my being there, when the number one danger is the traffic. I nearly got wiped out by a motorbike cutting in the foot-wide space between my stepping off a bus and the curb. And that was in Taipei!

"Motorbikes are cool," says one of my friends, "but all their drivers suck."

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-25 08:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] digitalemur.livejournal.com
I had no idea 长安街 was called the "Champs-Elysées of Beijing." That is really amusing.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-26 12:38 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bloodstones.livejournal.com
Actually, in some developing countries they encourage you to use formula rather than breast feed because it is not feasible for many women to get enough food to support breast feeding. I realize that the status thing is likely happening too, and it probably varies by country, but it is not unilaterally about status and is sometimes about the health of the mom.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-26 03:15 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] digitalemur.livejournal.com
Because I was 12 in 1989, my main association with that street is "where Tank Man stood." I learned the name of the street on those language CDs and it wasn't until a few months later that I found out why that was the very first street name they taught us while teaching us here and there.

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-26 03:37 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
It's a stretch, at least in terms of the streetscape itself. It is a similar broad central axis in the middle of the city, but it doesn't feel all that alike to walk down it. At least, not to me.

(Deleted previous comment as it wouldn't let me edit it! Silly LJ.)
Edited Date: 2014-11-26 03:43 am (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 2014-11-26 03:42 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] r-ness.livejournal.com
Yeah, China has some of the lowest breastfeeding rates in the world despite a recurrent problem with tainted baby formula, and efforts by the authorities to encourage breastfeeding.

Advertising has done quite a lot to encourage formula use, and I'm guessing this has a lot to do with the high status of cars as well.