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randomnessI dunno, I've started doing it myself. I can't figure out why it didn't occur to me sooner. The idea of walking around in an enclosed, climate-controlled space and avoiding the slush and snain of a Southern New England winter just makes sense.
It's particularly surprising to me because I'd done it before while travelling. Shopping malls are an excellent place to hide from inclement weather (heat in Southeast Asia, snow in Scandinavia) or dangerous levels of street crime (South Africa). Or in some countries, both (Brazil).
South African shops still have shorter hours on weekends, yet the malls are often quite full of window shoppers, even when the only businesses still trading are the movie theaters and the restaurants which as a result cluster near them. Security is fairly tight, and there are a lot of families taking advantage of the opportunity to take a walk around in air-conditioned safety.
For an American it's rather odd to see people walking around looking at the windows of closed shops, since in the States when the stores are closed they close the mall.
Speaking of security, Turkish malls were all provided with metal detectors and X-ray machines. I dutifully put my pack on the conveyor belt with everyone else's and walked through the arch, but it was pretty clear the detector was set with a high enough threshold so that everyone would pass, and the bored security guards often weren't even looking at the X-ray screen. This was obviously security theater, and everyone knew it, despite the fact that Turkey has had its share of shopping mall terrorism.
There were submachine-gun toting guards at the entrances to malls in Belo Horizonte and Brazilia, but they looked as bored as any rent-a-cops in the States, with more firepower. And the parking lots were thoughtfully provided with awnings over the spaces so your car's interior would stay somewhat shaded in the tropical sun. This was a feature some Thai shopping centers also offered. They looked lightly built but must clearly have been able to stand up to torrential downpours.
One feature of many malls in Asia that I really miss around here, however, is the transit station connected to the mall. I kept finding myself expecting a transit entrance either at the bottom or to one side of the mall. This clearly speaks to the primacy of mass transit in many Asian cities and the lack of social stigma attached to arriving at the mall by public transit. If there was transit to the mall I'd end up walking to transit, and then walking from transit, which would be a win all around.
Also, the food is better in most food courts in Asia than in food courts pretty much anywhere else in the world.
At some point I'll probably go on at some length in a post about how the tourist pursuit of exoticism drives them away from the mall and towards a historic bazaar or market, which then tends to turn into a tourist destination. This means that in many place the more authentic local experience will actually be found at the mall, which is where residents actually shop. But that'll go in another post, as this is getting long enough.
Another point is that I'd someday like to tour some malls around the world with someone who is more of a consumer than I am; I am that curious person who likes malls but generally doesn't buy much in them. As a result I believe there are many nuances of shopping which I believe I miss. I'd like to get some commentary on them, because so many of these aspects of life which look familiar in other countries actually differ in significant ways, and one can't get a good handle on them unless one has a greater understanding of how those aspects operate here.
It's particularly surprising to me because I'd done it before while travelling. Shopping malls are an excellent place to hide from inclement weather (heat in Southeast Asia, snow in Scandinavia) or dangerous levels of street crime (South Africa). Or in some countries, both (Brazil).
South African shops still have shorter hours on weekends, yet the malls are often quite full of window shoppers, even when the only businesses still trading are the movie theaters and the restaurants which as a result cluster near them. Security is fairly tight, and there are a lot of families taking advantage of the opportunity to take a walk around in air-conditioned safety.
For an American it's rather odd to see people walking around looking at the windows of closed shops, since in the States when the stores are closed they close the mall.
Speaking of security, Turkish malls were all provided with metal detectors and X-ray machines. I dutifully put my pack on the conveyor belt with everyone else's and walked through the arch, but it was pretty clear the detector was set with a high enough threshold so that everyone would pass, and the bored security guards often weren't even looking at the X-ray screen. This was obviously security theater, and everyone knew it, despite the fact that Turkey has had its share of shopping mall terrorism.
There were submachine-gun toting guards at the entrances to malls in Belo Horizonte and Brazilia, but they looked as bored as any rent-a-cops in the States, with more firepower. And the parking lots were thoughtfully provided with awnings over the spaces so your car's interior would stay somewhat shaded in the tropical sun. This was a feature some Thai shopping centers also offered. They looked lightly built but must clearly have been able to stand up to torrential downpours.
One feature of many malls in Asia that I really miss around here, however, is the transit station connected to the mall. I kept finding myself expecting a transit entrance either at the bottom or to one side of the mall. This clearly speaks to the primacy of mass transit in many Asian cities and the lack of social stigma attached to arriving at the mall by public transit. If there was transit to the mall I'd end up walking to transit, and then walking from transit, which would be a win all around.
Also, the food is better in most food courts in Asia than in food courts pretty much anywhere else in the world.
At some point I'll probably go on at some length in a post about how the tourist pursuit of exoticism drives them away from the mall and towards a historic bazaar or market, which then tends to turn into a tourist destination. This means that in many place the more authentic local experience will actually be found at the mall, which is where residents actually shop. But that'll go in another post, as this is getting long enough.
Another point is that I'd someday like to tour some malls around the world with someone who is more of a consumer than I am; I am that curious person who likes malls but generally doesn't buy much in them. As a result I believe there are many nuances of shopping which I believe I miss. I'd like to get some commentary on them, because so many of these aspects of life which look familiar in other countries actually differ in significant ways, and one can't get a good handle on them unless one has a greater understanding of how those aspects operate here.
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(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 03:05 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 06:28 am (UTC)But if you came back with an assortment of the coins and currency I'd certainly pay you back.
Sorry I didn't get to see you this last time. And thanks very much for organizing the card for E!
public transit
Date: 2011-01-05 03:16 am (UTC)Lots of people go to the Cambridgeside Galleria via the Lechmere stop on the Green line, with no apparent concern for stigma.
Burlington Mall, OTOH, is just part of the car-based, sprawling suburb. Such places are doomed when the oil runs out.
Re: public transit
Date: 2011-01-05 06:30 am (UTC)Yeah. It's just sad to me that we talk about these places and have to say "one of the few places". And that there are actually malls in this country which have explicitly tried to keep transit from coming to them. But that's all a part of the attitude that if you don't have a car you're not a desirable person, or some such noise.
Re: public transit
Date: 2011-01-05 03:36 pm (UTC)I will try to bring you back some currency from Nicaragua. I'm sorry I missed you in December too, but you had a lot going on. I'll catch you next time. :)
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 03:52 am (UTC)It's not just places like the Meadow Glen mall that bother me; the Burlington mall does too, as did the Glendale Galleria in its heyday. Even the various mall-like components of the Montreal underground have this effect. Oddly, the most notable exception is the Mall of America.
I hear you about tourism and the authentic experience. There are certainly plenty of places where a shopping district has become a tourist attraction, with varied results. The open-air Djemaa al-Fna seemed to have survived when I was last there, even though the adjacent covered souk mostly only catered to tourists. Closer to home, this is the complaint about Harvard Square (which is actually mostly doing OK, in my own opinion). Certainly, the extra traffic helps provide the economic conditions necessary to preserve the character of the place -- just having benevolent landowners, as much of Harvard Square does, is not enough.
Here's a thought for you as a tourist, though: I've had a great time seeking out the places that the locals go on vacation. This is what keeps bringing me back to Culebra. Such places tend to have terrific informal infrastructure that makes it easy to be there, and yet authentic at the same time.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 06:26 am (UTC)I hear you, and I understand the critiques of the places; nonetheless, I find visiting them when I have no intention to buy anything more engaging than when I actually have to buy something. The irony is that I don't find them particularly useful places to purchases.
The open-air Djemaa al-Fna seemed to have survived when I was last there, even though the adjacent covered souk mostly only catered to tourists.
Yeah, I found that in Syria it varied. The central market in Damascus pretty clearly was a tourist attraction, though there were still parts that functioned as a local market. In Aleppo, however, though there were clearly tourist-oriented vendors there were still a lot of shops for daily necessities.
I've had a great time seeking out the places that the locals go on vacation.
It is the greatest fun going with locals on their vacations. Not only do you get to see these neat places with, as you say, terrific infrastructure, but you get to see why they think it's fun.
I think a lot of what I do on trips is to try to get an idea of what it's like to live somewhere, and obviously one good way to do this is by sharing time with people who live there.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 11:17 am (UTC)I once ended up at Watertown Mall waiting for a friend dealing with the local motor vehicle office. Not much there, there.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 04:24 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 06:33 am (UTC)I seem to remember wandering through Tesco in south Bratislava at one point...and food shopping anywhere in Japan, Osaka included, is great fun.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 04:30 am (UTC)Speaking as a middle-aged woman, PBTHBTBTHPTH! :P
I found that in Montreal and Toronto, public transit was connected to the shopping areas pretty well. I wish they'd do that around here... oh wait...
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 06:17 am (UTC)Hah! Like there's anything wrong with middle-aged women and their pastimes? :)
I wish they'd do that around here... oh wait...
Yah, that's kind of an issue over there, isn't it.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 05:00 am (UTC)Anton's mentioned that going to malls was big in Manilla and Jakarta for some of the reasons you mentioned.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 11:14 am (UTC)I haven't been through there in much too long, though.
As for Manila and Jakarta I can imagine that they're a lot like Bangkok and Kuala Lumpur; all that heat, humidity, and pollution makes hiding in climate control very attractive.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 05:28 am (UTC)As for traveling with a shopper, I hate to say it but maybe you'd like traveling with my mom--it's about all she likes to do, go places, check out their malls, and go shopping.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 06:38 am (UTC)Is she into social analysis? I think the kind of shopper I'd like to travel with is someone who is conscious of the social construct he/she is interacting with, and has a deep understanding of the particular details of consumerism in America so they can contrast it with what they're seeing elsewhere.
I lack the deep understanding but I love the social analysis, and I think someone who has a better grasp of the details would great to travel with.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 07:47 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 11:11 am (UTC)The distinction I was probably unclear in originally expressing was that it would be fun to have someone with me who was able to explain to me, for example, exactly what it meant to be buying and/or carrying some consumer item (a particular smartphone, for example, or a particular handbag) and place it in whatever context they're familiar with at home, and then make some hypotheses about what that meant elsewhere.
One geeky example is that the social significance of carrying an iPhone is different from that of carrying one of a number of Android phones, and which generation iPhone, etc.
I do know some people I talk with about this sort of thing but I've never traveled with them. I guess the distinction is better expressed as that between going to malls to acquire objects and going there to acquire insights into the people who go to acquire objects.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 03:19 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-05-18 04:14 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 01:20 pm (UTC)Maybe next time I hear anyone pontificating about anywhere they visited in that particular smug way, I should ask what shopping centers they went to.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-06 05:08 am (UTC)Yes! Amazing, really. I love food shopping, home or abroad.
It amuses and annoys me to hear people talking about Jamaica with Insight (Into What's Wrong With Its People, no less) who've obviously never set foot off a Sandals resort, let alone into Coronation Market.
There does seem to be quite a bit of that going around. Often it seems to be people with a blinding lack of awareness of their own privilege going off about "the natives". Those of us who in some way might be natives share your annoyance.
One of my friends in Beijing inspired a post of mine a while back. If you didn't see it it's here.
It seems pretty universal.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 01:23 pm (UTC)i gather ikea may be helping to pay for a t-stop at the assembly square mall in somerville, but haven't paid attention in awhile....
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-06 05:09 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-06 02:59 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 10:40 pm (UTC)http://www.librarything.com/work/9168392
For MA anyway.
For example:
http://www.burlingtonmall.com/mallWalkers.php
http://www.simon.com/mall/guestservices.aspx?id=330
....so actually you CAN do it in the US, it's just you can only do it weekday mornings.
(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-05 10:40 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2011-01-06 05:10 am (UTC)